Building a Carpet Cleaning Business: Lessons in Success

Focus on reputation, authentic customer stories, and service excellence. Syndicate your reviews, engage locally, and offer unique programs – like VIP care or referral partnerships.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:00:00]:

I think it’s more just hiring on personalities. I think that’s the big key, making sure that their personalities are right for the business and right for going out and providing good service to customers. Like they’ve got to want to do the best job rather than just have a job, if that makes sense. So I think that would be key, personality for sure. Not so much skills, skills you can train and put them through IICRC training and that kind of thing to get them. Up to speed, but it’s really just hiring people that have that, um, natural tendency to care about people and things.

John Clendenning [00:01:18]:

Hey everybody, welcome back to another exciting episode of the Carpet Cleaner Success Podcast. Um, I really love these episodes when we’re actually talking to some successful cleaners, and this one, like, internationally around the world. So you guys hear me talking to a lot of folks in the States, some folks in Canada where I’m from and stuff like that. But we’re now talking to Nick right now from Exceed Carpet Cleaning, and he’s in Australia. And I think we’ve probably connected and known each other for about a year now, became one of our clients and is in our programs and stuff like that, just over a year, and got a great business running there. And what we’re going to do is just kind of pick his brain a little bit, figure out, uh, who Nick is, why he got into the cleaning industry, and what it’s all about. So welcome, Nick. Thanks so much for joining the podcast today.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:02:03]:

Thanks, John. Thanks for having me.

John Clendenning [00:02:05]:

Yeah, so tell everybody a little bit about you. So, um, what part of, uh, what part of the, the country are you from, and, uh, have you always lived there? Just tell a little bit of story of, uh, of, of who you are in the business.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:02:17]:

Um, yeah, sure. Um, so I’m from Canberra, Australia, which is the capital of Australia, not Sydney. Um, it’s about 500,000 people. Um, yeah, I’m 35, have a wife, two kids, um, and a carpet cleaning business.

John Clendenning [00:02:33]:

Yeah. And have you always lived in that area? Is that something you –  like, you born and raised there?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:02:38]:

I was born and raised in Canberra, and then I moved over to the West Coast in Perth for about 11 years.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:02:44]:

Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:02:44]:

Which is where I met my wife, and then, yeah, brought them all back over to Canberra where it’s nice and cold and away from the beaches.

John Clendenning [00:02:52]:

Fair enough. Yeah, I can’t remember where my uncle lives. So I got into carpet cleaning partially because I was doing janitorial. My uncle ran John Perry Distributors out of Australia. I don’t know the area well enough to know where he was from, but, and it was an international carpet distribution company. And he used to come over to Stratford, Ontario, one of the carpet –  they travel the world once a year going to all the different facilities and plants and rug places to bring more rugs back to sell to all the carpet stores in Australia. That was his business. And he came and Uncle Jackie came and chatted us up and it was probably 1992, ’93.

John Clendenning [00:03:32]:

And he said, John, you’re doing that cleaning thing. Have you ever done carpet cleaning? I’m going, nope. And we had a good little chat about it. He kind of put me in touch with one of his buddies who was an investment banker who left investment banking, started a cleaning company and was up to like 7, 8 trucks on the road or something like that, um, at that time. And so he put me in touch with him. I had a good chat with him, and that was one of the reasons why in 1995 I started my cleaning company. So I do have a little bit of a connection with the country, a little bit, very minor. But so, so what took you away, um, and what brought you back? Well, what like so got you, you know, move out of the area and then back, back into your hometown again?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:07]:

Uh, well, I just, uh, left the Army and moved back to Canada. And then I got a little bit bored in Canberra and decided that Perth was the only place I hadn’t really lived. So I decided to have a little holiday and end up staying for 10 or 11 years.

John Clendenning [00:04:22]:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And what did you do there? What, what kind of, what kind of work were you doing there that you eventually –  I need a carpet cleaning company.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:30]:

Working restaurants, and then I end up selling cars and hating that.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:34]:

Okay.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:35]:

And then I went into business doing furniture repairs. So, okay, I wanted to work for large companies like like Nick Scully here in Australia, Harvey Norman, that kind of thing.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:45]:

Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:04:47]:

Um, and then eventually started cleaning lounges first before carpet. Yeah, that, and then, um, that just naturally progressed into carpet cleaning because it’s a very similar system.

John Clendenning [00:04:59]:

Yeah. Um, yeah, well, that’s neat because I like that journey because you think like, yeah, so you, you kind of did the customer service thing, you tried the sales thing, which again car sales is more kind of like, you know, like I’ve got to be –  I don’t –  I’ve got lots of friends that are car salesmen, but it’s a different mentality than delivering a great service to a customer and saying, by the way, I recommend Protect, or I recommend you do this. That’s entirely different than, you know, hey, I need to sell this car. I don’t feed my family this week kind of idea. And what’s going on in your head is different. So you kind of learn the sales but realize you don’t need that level. But the customer service, you know, working in bars and stuff like that, you got to learn how to schmooze. And then the furniture repairs to the furniture cleaning, like that is just a nice natural progression to, hey, I could do this myself.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:05:47]:

So what was that next moment where you said, hey, I could actually do this business myself? I don’t need to go work for somebody else. I can actually start my own thing. How did that come about?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:05:56]:

Well, that the furniture repairs was my business.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:05:59]:

Okay, perfect. Yeah. Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:06:00]:

It’s just always been a part of who I am. Just, yeah, I always wanted to do my own thing or run my own business and not work for other people.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:06:10]:

Yeah. Where did that come from? Is there a family member?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:06:13]:

My father’s always been in –  well, since I was little, had his own business and –  and yeah, yeah, yeah.

John Clendenning [00:06:20]:

And that, that, that just, that just feeds us, right? It’s one of those things where if you see Dad doing it or if you’ve got like that uncle that, you know, you know, if Dad, Dad’s a teacher or does whatever, then you got that uncle, you go, ah, there’s that. I want to be more like that, right? So there’s always something that, that as a kid we see and it just kind of helps us gravitate to that. So that’s, that’s really cool. Um, and then when did you start the business? Um, when did Exceed actually –  carpet cleaning actually show up?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:06:45]:

So Exceed started just over 18 months ago, back when I was back in Canberra.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:06:50]:

Yeah.

Nick [00:06:51]:

Um, May 2024.

John Clendenning [00:06:53]:

Perfect. Yep. So, and let’s talk about that. So you’ve –  you’re, you’re fairly relatively new at it, and you kind of came back to town, so you at least know people, but you didn’t –  you know, you, you’re kind of building something, something new around that and stuff like that as well. Um, with the cleaning, what, what’s the journey been like so far? What have you been doing to, uh, sort of get your wiggle your way in around all of the other incumbents that already have cleaning companies? What’s the difference?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:07:18]:

Um, I think the difference is just, especially in Canberra, just caring. Yeah, caring about the people, caring about, um, their houses and doing a good job providing the best service you can. I think that’s been the key differences. Um, and then getting good reviews and feedback from there, and then Um, just snowballing basically.

John Clendenning [00:07:42]:

Yeah. And it is, again, we’re, as I say right now, like we’re, we, we, we talked before we jumped on and you follow a lot of my, my stuff and I’m, I’m trying not to be doomsday on one side, but on the other side, the world is changing faster than it’s ever changed before because, um, AI is taking over word of mouth. People talk to their chat friend more than they talk to their best friend. And I just had a conversation with my best, best friend Brad not that long ago. And I, I just on the weekend, like the, last weekend or the weekend before. And I said, dude, I just want to question you on this, um, because this is something that goes –  I, I, I explain to carpet cleaners all the time, but if, um, if you guys spilled –  you and Tara spilled something on the carpet, you know, that wine during Valentine’s Day weekend or something like that, um, I’m your buddy that own –  you’ve known me for 20-some-odd years, I’ve owned carpet cleaning companies for 30 years, um, would you call me? And he paused for a minute, he goes, No, I wouldn’t, John. And I said, what would you do? He goes, I’d ask ChatGPT, right? And this is a guy that didn’t even know what ChatGPT was 6 months ago. I had to show him.

John Clendenning [00:08:44]:

Like, he, he, he’s a, works at a, like, I just got a new job at a nuclear facility after years and years and years. ‘Cause he was in the auto industry and that’s, that’s a whole different story. But he started as a tool and die guy and worked his way all the way up to production manager and, and project manager. And they kind of sent him to Germany and back, the company and stuff like that. But I showed him what I was doing with AI and ChatGPT only about 6, 7 months ago. Other than that, he thought it was this little thing that could help you, you know, write an email or something, right? Um, and they didn’t even use it at their work at all. Everything was Microsoft and Copilot, which is a little bit better now but terrible. So anyways, but now he uses it for everything.

John Clendenning [00:09:23]:

He asks questions, he, you know, he logs his health journey and his fitness and all that kind of stuff once he started getting used to it. And he said, no, I would just ask Chat. And I said, and then if you went to hire somebody knowing that I’d sold the company already and stuff like that, so he’s not going to be calling me anyways. He’s not getting any free carpet cleaning. So if you’re going to hire somebody because you realized you tried the club soda we recommend, I guarantee it, and the blotting with the towel and blah, blah, blah, and it’s still a little bit of a stain and you’re now, how do I get the red dye out of the whatever? And it kind of found some information. Would you question me who you were going to hire? He goes, if they recommended one good person and there was a reason why, I wouldn’t. If it gave me a couple choices, I might ping you on text and say, hey, we spilled something on the carpet. They’re recommending one of these two companies.

John Clendenning [00:10:08]:

Which one do you know? He goes, other than that, no, I wouldn’t question you at all. I am a cleaner in the industry, 30 years experience, and his best friend. If I –  he wouldn’t ask me for that. How many customers do you think are asking their friends about, you know, somebody that just arrived in their home. So what the two points we’re trying to make here is, and it dovetails into your customer service and stuff like that, is how grandpa and your dad and people used to run a business is more important now than ever. You need to know people. You need to be real. Don’t hide behind a computer.

John Clendenning [00:10:43]:

Answer the phone or have somebody answering the phone. Be authentic. Call back if they’ve got a problem. Apologize and come and solve it. We always used to bring them a gift. We called it Recipe for Recovery. We’d bring them a gift. Little puppy dog face on.

John Clendenning [00:10:56]:

I’m so sorry we had to come back. Let me show me that spot or stain because we built like these little dip chiller things we bought at the dollar store, but we put some dip in it, some crackers and say, I’m sorry we had to come back. Why? Because we wanted to be so much different than everybody else. We wanted to say, what’s the next level of customer service we can do? What’s the next level, right? If anybody caught up with us, okay, we’re going to beat you because these are little $2, $3, $5 things, but they mean the world to people when you actually authentically you know, care about them. You know, we taught our technicians, you know, if you happen to knock something over and break it, don’t hide it. Bring it. I’m so sorry. Look what I really apologize.

John Clendenning [00:11:35]:

We’ll replace that, obviously. And half the time, the customers go, just because you’re drippingly sad about it, they’re going, no, don’t worry about it. I didn’t care about that anyways. That was my husband’s ex-wife’s. I don’t want it, you know, kind of idea. And you find that out. But yeah, so that, you know, being more authentic with AI where you’re telling real customer stories, but being more authentic by actually getting back into the marketplace, joining the chamber, reaching out to people, just being in touch with them. Those two things are going to make people exceed, literally grow their company.

John Clendenning [00:12:06]:

So what kind of things like when you’re being that authentic, what do you notice some of the other guys that you hear the stories of some of the other cleaners that have probably forgotten that message and the fact that you’re sort of new back to it, you have to, you have to double down anyways and you’re obviously wanting to add that level of service. What have you noticed? What are some of those stories that, uh, that you guys are – 

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:12:24]:

you’re going, I’m going to do better than a lot of, um, just lack of care? Like, yeah, not using corner guards in houses, dragging hoses through, damaging walls. It’s just, it’s the same sort of thing. Um, not taking their time doing a good job, just in and out as quickly as possible.

John Clendenning [00:12:39]:

Um, is that because of pricing, do you think? Like, they’re trying to be cheap and fast as opposed to –  like, I’ve always been high-end. Like, we always tell customers, we’re not the most expensive, but we’re not the cheapest. And in fact, you could call some of the cheapest and you’d pay more than you’re going to pay us by the time and they nickel and dimed you with everything else, right? Yeah. And is that where you’re finding like these guys are trying to just rush in and out and get, you know, you know, a couple hundred bucks and not actually take the time to do a good job?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:13:04]:

I think it’s both. Um, yeah, okay. I think some companies just have a reputation because they’ve been around for so long and they’ve sort of become a bit lazy or a bit relaxed about it. Yeah. And then I think there are definitely the, the people that don’t charge enough for what they’re doing and just try and rush it. So I think it’s definitely a mix of both here.

John Clendenning [00:13:25]:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And again, you’re so new at it. I mean, as far as the business, you’re obviously, by the sounds of it, you and I’ve talked before, your goal is to, you know, hire the crews, train them up as well as you, and do all of that kind of stuff so that –  so you –  because that’s, that’s that moment where you go, okay, I care a lot. How do I make, you know, Kyle care as much? Kind of idea. What’s your thoughts on that? Like, how do you like –  because again, it is sometimes maybe those guys were great when they were one guy in a truck, but that’s not sustainable if you really want to have a lifestyle. You know, mom gets sick or something like that. You want to go spend 6 weeks with her and help her, help her out around the home. You want to have a business that still allows you to run a business even if you can’t always be there every single day.

John Clendenning [00:14:10]:

That’s ultimately the goal. Why we bought a business. It’s a headache unless you get the freedom on the other side of it. Go see the kids dance recital and stuff like that, right? So what are some of your thoughts around, you know, as you expand the business, finding those right people, but making sure they do it the Nick’s way?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:14:28]:

I think it’s more just hiring on, on personalities. I think that’s the big, the big key, making sure that their personalities are right for the business and right for, going out and providing good service to customers. Like, they’ve got to want to, want to do the best job.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:14:43]:

Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:14:43]:

Um, rather than just have a job, if that makes sense. So I think that would be key. Personality for sure, not so much skills. Skills you can train, um, and put them through IICRC training and that kind of thing to get them up to speed. But it’s really just hiring people that have that, um, natural tendency to care about people and, and things.

John Clendenning [00:15:04]:

Yeah, and that is –  that becomes the hiring. This attitude is something you can’t train in, right? It’s everything else is that you can train them how to do this. Now they can give them some scripts on how to talk to Mrs. Jones a little bit better and, and all that kind of stuff. And I, as I said, the three-tier packaging as an owner. Yeah, we can probably sell protector to everybody and sanitizer and upsell the couch if we, you know, whatever. And ethically, again, it’s like if you haven’t got the couch cleaned in 2 years, probably it’s You know, you’ve sat on with your bum, there’s probably a good reason to clean it kind of idea. But you might not get a technician who would have that conversation as well.

John Clendenning [00:15:37]:

But, you know, there’s things, little things you can put in place like pre-priced packaging and things like that so the customer can upsell themselves to a more premium offer. That, that stuff, some of that stuff makes sense as well. And, and yeah, just making sure they do the corner guards and lay the mats down the hallways for their hose and they’re not trying to rush through. And they wouldn’t rush through if you’re targeting the right clients and charging a good price. So, so speaking of that, like, so let’s talk about some of the clients, like the, the clientele that is, is ideal for Xceed. Because, you know, as we start out, we take anybody, but then we start realizing we don’t want to take anybody. Um, we start building a reputation to the right people. Um, how have you seen that transition in 18 months?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:16:23]:

Um, yeah, quite rapidly, I think. Um, I got onto the Carpet Cleaning Success Podcast pretty quickly, um, and was straight into marketing to the higher end. Um, that’s where I focused all my time from the get-go rather than just whoever I could, could get in the door. Um, I was lucky to be working while building the business and have a bit of flexibility there, so I could take the time to do things, not 100%, but to a point where I was targeting the right people or who I needed to target. Um, still every now and then took a job that I probably shouldn’t have.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:17:00]:

Yeah, we all do. Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:17:02]:

Um, like just paint disasters and things like that and just sitting in the middle of that job going, why am I here? Like, I’m not making anything. I’m, I’m probably losing money doing this job, but yeah, yeah, you learn.

John Clendenning [00:17:16]:

Yeah, it’s a, it’s a hard one because there you again, when you, when you’re a giver as well, you want to help out. Like I, I have been on the 12th floor of –  and I’ve had technicians on the 12th floor of the apartment building helping, you know, Granny Smith and her one little sitting room and the bedroom. And you realize the whole –  it took you an hour to get all the equipment up and in or whatever, right? You had to take the portable, not the, you know, the truck, and then whatever you’re doing. And then by the time you get in there and you do your pre-vac, you have a good chat with her and all that, because she wants you to sit down for tea. And the actual square footage of carpet is not much bigger than your bathroom. And it’s like, you know, you’re going – 

Nick [00:17:52]:

and it’s been half a day.

John Clendenning [00:17:54]:

Yeah, he spent half a day and it’s like, yeah, but you know, when you’re a giver, it’s sort of like, it’s like, okay, we had a good –  and then on the hindsight of that, I had a good, I had a good mentor back in the day, um, Peter, and, um, he used to –  Peter Snow –  and he used to say, take all of those jobs, um, again, charge your right price, be, be yourself, um, charge, but take all of those jobs and care more than anybody else. Because you never know who their neighbor, friend, or, you know, children are. And that has been so true. I have gone and done jobs where, and I’ve had calls from, you know, the daughter or the son. I want to thank you so much. My mother has not stopped raving about you. By the way, can you come and take a look at our house or my business? Or I am the maintenance manager of the City of Guelph. Can you please come and give us a quote for all of the Guelph facilities and it turned into a $15,000, $20,000 a year job.

John Clendenning [00:18:49]:

Yeah, because mother, who wasn’t –  didn’t seem like we cared enough to do –  so teaching technicians that is also, also pretty helpful. But yeah, and I do like that. I like –  I mean, we –  I’ve had this message for years with, um, cleaners. There’s a lot of, as I, I call them now, the forum flexers, guys at a show, their $1,000, $2,000 check I got today from this big job and stuff like that. Um, and they’re on the forums, they all care about what truck mount they have and they care about this and all that kind of stuff, but they’re still the same guy in the truck 5, 10 years later because they’re still chasing, you know, their minimum price is still $97 or $129 for 3 rooms. And because everybody else in their marketplace is. And what they don’t realize is the top 5, 3, 1% of a marketplace isn’t, right? That, that top percentage is, um, they, they they do a better job, they target better people. Their average job is $400, $500, $600 and growing.

John Clendenning [00:19:50]:

And as they get into those communities, those communities don’t look at discount ads. Those communities don’t look at somebody taking a black carpet that looks like a motorcycle drove over it and cleaning it to make it, oh, look at how amazing I can clean. You know, those people look at it and go, I’ve never driven a motorcycle in my living room. I like to see somebody in a house like mine where the, you know, the the main room and the, you know, they’ve got the media room with the, you know, 27-foot wraparound sectional and stuff like that. If you can show pictures of that, they’re going, that’s my house, that’s my people, right? And so as you kind of, you know, even in condos, they might not be quite as big, but they’ve got the baby grand overlooking the river or overlooking the countryside or wherever it is. You know, when you’re taking sort of these before and after pictures or before, during, after stories, um, and putting those out for real, you’re also attracting the right person because they see themselves in it. If you park your, your van in front of a house, if it’s in front of a house with, you know, broken windows and siding falling off, that’s different than if it’s in front of a nice, you know, a nice medium-sized estate, right? Because then all of a sudden, the people that work for them, now when you say, hey, you show that up on social media, you put that on LinkedIn, all that kind of –  and then you say, hey, I’m reaching out. I just want to see if you want to be a referral partner to a real estate agent, interior designer.

John Clendenning [00:21:12]:

Oh, I’ve seen you guys, right? Because you’re, you’re in the right neighborhoods, you’re in –  you’re getting the right people. And then the word spreads fast, even like, again, even in the days of AI, you’re starting to tell those stories in the right places. So, um, what are some of the things that have worked well? So again, we had the second –  we have –  we had a full-time job and you were able to do the straddle over, which again, Mark Sager talks about as well. It always takes a bit of grind to get going. You got to get the flywheel started. And once you get the flywheel started, you’re in the right place. If you can start the flywheel in the right direction, which you did, you save yourself years of headache of having to take this work, hoping to get that work, because that’s –  that straddle is even harder. So what’s kind of worked? What are some of the things that have –  that have worked to get you into those communities and get you into the right homes and stuff like that, that, um, you may –  some of our listeners would go, oh, there’s a good idea right there.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:22:06]:

Um, look, honestly, it started off with a lot of luck to begin with. Okay. Um, and I think especially in Canberra, it’s quite a good place to have a carpet cleaning business because the, like, the average wage is quite high in Australia.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:22:20]:

Yeah.

Nick [00:22:21]:

Um, and Because there’s a lot of public servants.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:22:26]:

Okay. Yep.

Nick [00:22:27]:

So it’s a lot of safe, highly consistent jobs, if that makes sense.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:22:32]:

With pensions. With pensions.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:22:34]:

Yeah. So yeah, with good –  we have super here. We still have pensions, but not so much. And yeah, so I think it started off with luck and then it was just that good service to get good reviews or good feedback and then just promoting that, those reviews or feedback to continue that, that snowball effect of just finding more people who wanted good service and, and then getting them to provide feedback. And, and I think that’s been the key to everything so far, is just provide such a good service that they want to tell people about it and they want to give you the feedback or put a Google review down saying how great it was so that other people come through and do this.

John Clendenning [00:23:21]:

And then one of our big things we talk about is syndicating those, because less and less people make it to Google. The AI is at the top. So like, we like to do is just share those out on other platforms, make sure like those happy customer stories and Google reviews just –  and customer feedback –  and just like become the best known cleaner with the best reputation. It’s called reputation marketing. But don’t just rely on, you know, I’ve got some, um, some people I talk to that they’re up to their like 1,022 reviews now. And they’re average. And it’s like, and they have not –  they’re crickets everywhere else. Yeah.

John Clendenning [00:23:54]:

So the Google crowd finds them, but 100% of people don’t go to Google, right? No. So some people go to Facebook, talk to their friends, they go, you know, they go elsewhere. They, they might go to, you know, go to your website. They might, they might go down different rabbit holes, but they don’t always go to Google. They might talk to the carpet store and just say, hey, you put the flooring in, the carpet, the tile, the whatever a year or two ago, starting to look dingy. Who do I call? Right. So us having relationships with those stores and offering –  I had a program years ago, first cleaning on us, right? It’s something I’m actually looking to revamp. There’s actually –  if you go to firstcleaningus.com or.ca, the website’s still up, actually.

John Clendenning [00:24:31]:

But it’s –  it was –  I would target carpet stores, area rugs, carpets, furniture. And if somebody bought something, if they wanted to enroll in it, we would stay in touch with them for the first year. And at the end of the first year, the first cleaning up to a certain dollar amount would be on us. And then after that, it would go after that dollar amount or if they wanted protector or other things. But why did I do that? Because I only worked with the high-end carpet stores. Yeah. So I’m not worried about getting, you know, geared to income rental home. Right? We worked with the high-end carpet stores.

John Clendenning [00:25:09]:

They, they could offer the first cleaning on us, not installing in a rental or in a, you know, Airbnb or anything like that. It would be to install it into a real customer’s home. That would be our relationship. And for that, we’d give their service techs free bottles of spot remover. I’d stop around every month with donuts and give them more spot removers. And because they ran the first cleaning on us and it’d just be sitting right beside the till with a QR code and, hey, you just bought carpet or tile or whatever, would you like the first cleaning? And we actually made it first cleaning on us was the carpet store was the one giving it away. We were just the referral partner.

Nick [00:25:40]:

So we made them look very powerful.

John Clendenning [00:25:43]:

Right. So yeah, all these little cool marketing things. So, so those are the good stuff. I always like to like, you know, we told, you know, the wrong customer. What are some of the pitfalls that, you know, again, you’ve been at it for 18 months and what are some of the things that the odd thing that you maybe said, you know, hey, I wish I didn’t do that. I’ve corrected course already or something. Is there any funny stories or any Any sort of moments where, you know, you know, it’s like you had –  you, you learned your lesson kind of idea that come up?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:26:09]:

Oh, uh, definitely. Just take –  like I said earlier, just taking jobs on that I really shouldn’t have, um, just because either it was a lack of experience or not qualifying customers as well as I should have on the phone. Yeah, I’m finding that’s getting a lot better now, but, um, especially initially before I had any systems in place or any anything like that, not qualifying enough. So just being like, oh, how many rooms? 3. Okay, no worries, it’ll be this much. I’ll be out today, tomorrow.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:26:37]:

Yeah.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:26:37]:

And then get there and just find that like there’s paint throughout the carpet. Like there’s one job where I think the customer said there was just a little bit of paint on the floor that they need cleaned up. I got there and it was a whole bedroom just orange paint from wall to wall.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:26:52]:

Oh gosh.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:26:53]:

Yeah, way too long trying to get it out. And in the end, I just said, look, I’m sorry, this isn’t coming out. Sorry to waste your time as well as my own, but let’s work on something.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:27:04]:

Yeah.

Nick [00:27:05]:

Yeah.

John Clendenning [00:27:05]:

And all the solvent fumes too, if you’re using perp or one of those. Yeah. It’s just like you’re starting to get a little loopy from doing it as well.

Nick [00:27:12]:

So yes, start talking to yourself.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:27:14]:

Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:27:16]:

That’s probably the biggest thing I’ve learned so far is just qualify people that your leads or your clients that are coming through, just so that you know for yourself, but also so you know what they need. Yeah. If you’re qualifying for their needs and getting a better idea, you can help them better and they appreciate it more rather than just quick and, and, and that on the phone.

John Clendenning [00:27:41]:

Yeah. What are some of the things you do to qualify them? Where like, so, because that’s a learning lesson and we all figure it out. I was a shy kid, so it’s like, If I went in, I needed something in my head to say. So I would lock them in pretty quickly because I didn’t want to have to guess on the spot, right? So if I said something and it kind of came across wrong or they didn’t understand it, I’d get embarrassed. I’d go red-faced right in front of them, right? So it’s like, okay. And I find that I beat myself up between that and the next job. I’d say it differently. And next thing you know, oh, that little, the knees of your jeans when we talk about traffic lanes, you know, You might get the dirt out, but if you knelt in the garden every single day, even if you threw them in the wash, by the time you, you took them out of the wash, they’d still look like you knelt in the garden a little bit because that’s the traffic lanes in your home.

John Clendenning [00:28:25]:

Does that make sense, Mrs. Jones? And that would be, oh yeah, that makes sense. Okay, so that’s what’s going down the center of your hallway. I can’t get it to look perfect. I just can make it look a lot better. Here, let me do a spot for you and show you. And it became these little, like, even on-the-job qualifiers. But yeah, on-the-phone qualifiers and stuff like that.

John Clendenning [00:28:40]:

What are some of the ones that you kind of do now that that kind of keep you from as much as possible getting into one of those, those, you know, unfortunate situations?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:28:49]:

The biggest thing is just ask a lot of questions. Yeah, that’s the biggest thing you can do. Have a real talk with the, with the customer on the phone before you start trying to book them in or get into pricing. Just get a really good idea of what, what they’re after and the job that they require. I, I have a probably 2 or 3 pages now of questions that I’m like, all right, make sure you ask this. Because I’m like, like you are, I’m very shy when it comes to interacting with people. So I, I have to have everything set out and make sure I’ve got all, all my notes and things of what to ask and, and, and why to ask it and things like that, and how to, yeah, talk to them and explain things. Um, because yeah, I will beat myself up if I’m like – 

John Clendenning [00:29:33]:

and I think, I think that’s the thing, like, I, I don’t think that’s –  I think it’s a superpower because I people like, again, if you –  I’ve got friends that are just like Type A, walk into a room and they’re just talking to everybody and they’re off they go and off they go. And it’s like, cool, that’s not me. But if I can learn my way in and figure out my structure, I overthink it to the point I dial it in. Right? And I think that, again, that’s what you’ve done as well. You’re asking these questions. Now, tell me this, after you’re done asking those questions, How many people go, oh my gosh, I called a bunch of other companies and nobody’s been as thorough as you are. Do you hear that? Exactly. So you’ve just actually gotten into their head like, my God, you’re better than everybody else because you’re going, I just want to be real and have a good understanding before I, I, I carry on pricing or get what we can do.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:30:25]:

Definitely. I’ll ask simple questions like, what type of carpet do you have? Is it wool? Is it synthetic? And they’re like, no one’s asked me that yet. It’s important, especially if you’re dealing with pet stains or something like that.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:30:36]:

Yeah, and you guys have a lot more wool carpet, like wall-to-wall carpet, than we do here. Like, that was – 

Nick [00:30:41]:

yeah, carpet is everywhere.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:30:42]:

Yeah, yeah.

Nick [00:30:43]:

So you’ve got to find out.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:30:45]:

Yeah, yeah, you can’t get it too wet. You don’t want brown, browning, all that stuff. And yeah, pet stains are going to be nasty on that.

Nick [00:30:52]:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you need to make them aware that, like, urine can pH burn wool, that kind of thing. Yeah. So the stain might not all come out.

John Clendenning [00:31:00]:

So yeah. Yeah. And I find –  so what I learned is, and that’s again, great advice for the audience because it’s sort of like a lot of people, you know, how can I help you? You know, how did you hear about us? Okay, that’s going to be this price. Okay, thank you. Click. And they wonder, oh, everybody that calls me is a price shopper. No, I think your marketing is price shopping. And then the way you answer the phone is like, You know, when I was off the phones and handed it over to staff and stuff like that, it was like they had a script in front of them because it’s like, hey, I want you to get through a few things.

John Clendenning [00:31:31]:

And then as I learned better persuasion and sales, we wiggled the script the same way though. But it’s like, hey, it’s a great day here at, you know, I always say, how can I help you? Was originally, but now it’s what information can I get for you today or what information are you looking for? So great day here at ABC Carpet Cleaning. What information, you know, Definitely looking to help you. What information can I get for you today? And that, that, that little change of what information –  I learned that from a, a sales coach by the name of Matt Easton. That little change of what information actually triggers a different thought process in their brain. And you can actually put a scan on it and see it. Like, it’s like, again, the nerdy side of it. They have to go, oh, right.

John Clendenning [00:32:07]:

And now all of a sudden you just derailed them for a second. Derailing people from a narrative of, I just need a price, I just need a price, is beautiful. Cause then there’s a And then, cool, I can definitely help you with that. Quick question for you. What research have you done on us so far? That –  not how did you hear about it, but what research is a much better strategic question because now they’re going to go, well, I saw your van in a driveway, then I talked to my friend, then I went on Facebook and I kind of been following you guys for at least like 6 months now before I was ready to call you. That’s much better than, oh, I saw your ad, right? One of those two might be true, but what research?

Nick [00:32:39]:

Nothing.

John Clendenning [00:32:39]:

I just saw your ad. Like, I’m on Google right now. Oh, cool. Okay, well, you know, tell me a little bit more about those areas. And then you start asking your questions and you do that triage. Cool. I think I’ve got a really good understanding of what you’re looking to do. Now, while I’m figuring out an estimate for you, I can’t give you an exact price on the phone.

John Clendenning [00:32:56]:

In fact, I don’t think anybody should give you an exact –  this is what I always said –  is an exact price because we haven’t seen it yet. We don’t know the sizes. Carpet cleaning is a function of time and material. If somebody gives you an exact price, they’re either undercharging you and going to have to rush through the job or sell you a whole bunch of extras, or they’re overcharging you and they’re going to smile sweetly and not tell you. What we do is we give –  it’s going to be based on, you know, size of rooms, this and that, whatever, number of furniture, number of stains. And you do have a choice of 3 separate packages. So while I’m figuring out an estimate for you, let me tell you why most people who call do choose us to clean their carpets. And even just that, I learned that from a Richard Bandler NLP training.

John Clendenning [00:33:34]:

But Why most people call Choose Us to clean their carpets. And then you keep rolling. It’s because of –  and then you offer your guarantee. We have the very best cleaning and the very best guarantees. Our guarantees are this. Oh my God, those are better than everybody else. Yes. And the reason –  the only reason we can offer those guarantees is because we have this special whiz-bang cleaning system we named for ourselves.

John Clendenning [00:33:55]:

Now you’re separating. Well, nobody else has the, you know, the Exceed Excellent 12-Step Program or whatever. Right now, you’ve created a system of one. So, and then you say, so on the day of cleaning, the technician’s gonna do this and this and this first, a full pre, thorough pre-inspection, test your spots and stains, blah, blah, blah. And then you’re gonna have a choice of one of our three packages. So what we don’t like to do is just lump everybody into the same lump. So, and we don’t wanna sell you extras that you don’t need. So our basic package is this, and mine was always clean and protect.

John Clendenning [00:34:22]:

I got rid of clean only really early on because we were able to explain to people why. So that became one of our superpowers. And then clean, protect, sanitize, deodorize. Joint part of our VIP club with a 1-year warranty, right? And a free bottle of our spot remover. That was middle package. And then we had our Always Clean. We’ll come back and re-clean and you’re, you know, and, and, and, and, and. And when I sold the business, Carl that owns it now, that, that package is $1.29 a square foot and he still sells it 30% of the time.

John Clendenning [00:34:48]:

We’ve always been about 30% of the time the high-end package, which includes 2 cleanings a year. And the second one’s just a traffic lane cleaning. So our very –  because we know our avatar, our very best clients want us to come back and touch it up, right? And while we’re there, you might as well clean my sofa and my –  take my area rugs with you. And now all of a sudden you’re in the house twice a year, right? And for $1.30 a square foot, $1.29 a square foot, those jobs are averaging –  the first cleaning is about $600, $700. It’s worth going back and doing a traffic lane touch-up in 6 months just to get back in the house for all the other reasons you get back, because now you have a reason to call them and things like that. So But having that, that ask the questions, get in their head, be that friendly person, or hire the girl on the phone when you don’t have time to do it or whatever, to understand that. Listen to 20, 30 of my calls. Here’s the way I word it.

John Clendenning [00:35:37]:

Here’s the script. Nowadays, that’s –  I used to have to write them down, listen, try, do all that kind of stuff, learn. Now that’s AI. Just take, record 20 of your calls, put it in AI and say, hey, of the ones that booked, what did I do right? Now I want to train Lisa how to do that. When she’s doing the calls, give her the script and just say, hey, I’m going to record all your calls and I’m going to run it through because I’m not around the office when you’re answering them. And I’m going to have –  we’re going to meet at the end of the week and make sure that you’re learning how to get a little bit better and a little bit better. We’re in a world now where all of this human touch, but with automation and AI to help us lift better and faster, that’s way better than a self-booking button on your website and saying, oh, go book yourself. Figure out our prices, you know, all of it.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:36:21]:

So it’s expensive for somebody else, right?

Nick [00:36:23]:

So booking, if you want to be the, like, just the cheapest guy in the market.

John Clendenning [00:36:26]:

Exactly. Definitely. But yeah, I don’t mind sending a link. Like, if you’ve got Housecall Pros or ServiceMonster and you want to send a link to a past client saying, hey, give us a call, you’re, you know, your anniversary cleaning’s coming up, you do get the anniversary bonuses, um, and stuff like that, you can go book yourself, you know our pricing, or you can give us a call and we’ll work with you, walk you through it. Totally up to you. They already know you. I still prefer the human touch, but if you really want to do it there, but don’t put a self-booking button on your website. There is no AI that can answer questions properly.

John Clendenning [00:36:54]:

And there’s no way you can qualify your pricing that well against the competitors that are all undercharging and stuff like that.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:37:00]:

Or just the, the time that they’ll require that day or the job that they want done. They might say, I want 3 bedrooms carpet cleaned because, and self-book for an hour or whatever. But then you get there and it’s a lot of detail work or there’s a lot of stains to do.

John Clendenning [00:37:14]:

Yeah, air filtration lines that you’ve got, which we used to charge $2 a linear foot for air filtration lines. So we’d say, hey, you’ve got black edges around. Yeah. Is that an entertainment center always going to be there? Is that china cabinet? Yeah. So let’s not worry about that right now until you decide to move it, because I don’t want to have you empty it out, move it out just to get rid of a dark line that we’re just going to put it right back and hide. But if you do, what I’ll do is I’ll do –  our team will do, um, 2 feet for you to show you what it’s going to look like. We use the carbon reducer, we do the edge tool, we do all that kind of stuff on our hands and knees. It’s not included.

John Clendenning [00:37:46]:

Wiping the edges included, but getting rid of air filtration lines, that’s totally different. If you like what we did, we’ll just measure the linear feet and it’s 2 feet. That’s extra, but that’s an extra hour in the home. You might make an extra $150, $200 because of the time done. But, and I even had friends of mine that were in the cleaning world that they had been, had a handyman career before. They go, yeah, I do that, John. But then I also go and caulk underneath the, the baseboards. I got –  I’m a technician using caulking anywhere near carpets because now we got caulking to take out of the carpets, right? But they would actually seal that air filtration line behind the walls.

John Clendenning [00:38:21]:

I don’t know if you guys get it there, but in North America with heating systems, all that, it’s just that air moves back and forth and it creates just that black carbon soot line and it’s hard to get out and you have to work your butt off. So that’s extra. Right.

Nick [00:38:34]:

So, right.

John Clendenning [00:38:35]:

A red wine stain, extra, you know what I mean? Like nail polish in the daughter’s room, a couple of little slops. Sure, I’ll include it. But an entire bottle of nail polish? Yeah, we’re charging you for time and materials, right? So we always –  $2 a minute. So if it took an hour, it’s $120. That’s how we did it. Yeah, right. And we would say, hey, that one looks like it’s going to take about 30 minutes. We’re going to have to put an ink remover on it with a towel and start melting the then whatever.

John Clendenning [00:39:00]:

Eventually might have to get rid of the dye underneath and stuff like that. Um, so yeah, we –  you could have different ways of pricing. We always did, um, $2 a minute, um, and we’d estimate how long it would take roughly. Um, and that’s –  and they’d have to say yes or no. If they said no, that part was taken out of our –  we guarantee the most thorough cleaning ever, it’s free. If you’re not happy, we’ll come back and reclean. If you’re still not happy, we’ll pay somebody else to take the stain out or clean the carpets than us. That would be waived because you said no to the extra service.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:39:25]:

If it needed extra service.

Nick [00:39:27]:

That’s all we do. Yeah, yeah.

John Clendenning [00:39:30]:

So cool. So I think, yeah, I mean, I love the fact that again, in such a short time, you’ve got –  you, you came in with the right mindset, and the mindset is the most important. A lot of folks come into the industry, and again, as AI starts displacing some middle, middle-income jobs and stuff like that, and you know, they’re going to try and find other work, and maybe handyman, maybe carpet cleaning, maybe, you know, open a franchise of anything, but we do find that this happened in the recession, 2008, ’09, ’10, the global recession as well, is as people get displaced, one of the industries that feels like an easier barrier of entry is the cleaning world, maid services, janitorial, and carpet cleaning a little bit, pressure washing, things like that. So, and, but as they come in, again, the vast majority, the odd one, but the vast majority don’t have the mindset that I am a business owner. Who happens to own a cleaning business there. They want to become a cleaner that just happens to put their shingle out and call themselves a business. And they don’t run it as a –  I’m a business and I got to work on business systems and I deal with the right client and eventually the right technician. And just, you know, they kind of wing it by the seat of their pants.

John Clendenning [00:40:35]:

So, so with that in mind, because I mean, I think you like your journey has been really cool as you came in with the right attitude. You’ve got the history of dad and running companies and stuff like that, running your own businesses in the past and all that. What would be some parting advice for, you know, anybody listening to this? We’ve got people, you know, brand new to it, like you when you started listening to these. We’ve got people that are 20 years in and going, I think I’ve done it, you know, the right way or the wrong way for 20 years. What would be some parting advice that you would say would the average business owner and cleaner should think of?

John Clendenning [00:41:08]:

Just, just absorb information however you can, whether you read books or listen to podcasts or watch YouTube videos, just continue to absorb information and find the right avenues of information that work for you and just keep learning. Yeah, that would be my biggest – 

John Clendenning [00:41:26]:

Yeah, I think that’s –  Yeah, being a student of it. I used to drive around with cassette tapes, literally, and I’d have the one on the pen, like I’d be driving like this, listening to this one and rewinding it that this way because I wanted to put this one in next. And I had to –  the old days of cassette tapes, way before you, you probably, you know, like even see you’re going to this podcast, dude, I don’t even know what you’re talking about. But I set tapes, and I was like rewinding to listen to, you know, The E-Myth by Michael Gerber and, and just anything I could get my hands on to just feed the brain and just go, okay, how do I become more positive? How do I talk better? How do I –  whatever those things are –  how do I run a better, better business? Who do I learn from? And I think if we understand that, you know, you can drive between jobs and listen to, you know, Baby Metal or, you know, or whatever, any, you know, whatever your band of choice is and, you know, stuff like that. And you can, you know, and you can be in the drive-thru of somewhere and, you know, have your, you know, you know, thrash metal and stuff like that going out or your, or whatever it is, right? Your AC/DC and all that kind of stuff, right? You can, or you could be actually listening to something that, oh my God, that’s a great idea. Let me write that down. Oh my gosh. There’s, yeah.

John Clendenning [00:42:37]:

Let me, when I get home tonight, I can’t, you know, I gotta, I gotta work on that. That sounds amazing. Right? And now you’re growing. Now you’re learning and growing.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:42:45]:

So definitely, yeah. And you can get through a lot of podcasts or audiobooks in, in a day when you’re driving around doing, doing the cleaning.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:42:52]:

Absolutely. That’s one of the –  that window time is really cool because you really do.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:42:55]:

Even just, um, I have Bluetooth headphones, and while I’m cleaning, I’m listening. Like, yeah, that’s 8 hours a day. That’s a lot of time to learn something.

John Clendenning [00:43:03]:

It absolutely is. Yep. So yeah, I always told our technicians, um, The technicians, it was hard at first. When we first tried to get them, we didn’t want them having the cable up, but when it became the Bluetooth, that’s fine. But I didn’t want them –  I always said, you can only put it in one ear. Eventually it was not –  never at all, never at all. And that wasn’t working after a period of time because they weren’t listening to podcasts. They’re listening to, you know, tunes and stuff like that full blast.

John Clendenning [00:43:27]:

The customer has to tap them on the shoulder. That’s, you know, that’s not good customer service. So at the very least, you could only go out with one. We actually made them leave the second one behind at the shop. Now, did they ever have that second pair? Probably, but the whole idea was I would stop in on jobs and bring them coffees and stuff like that, talk to the customer, um, how’s everything going, I just happened to be in the neighborhood, I just came back from a chamber meeting, whatever, um, but I’d stop by to make sure because they, again, they had a performance bonus, and if I caught the van wide open and stuff all over the driveway or, you know, any of those things that just didn’t represent the company well, or wearing both headphones, um, not having their indoor shoes on because they changed their shoes at the door and put a you know, Matt, like, I –  one of the things is they’ll all say yes until you don’t check all the time. And if you –  if they know that at any moment you could just spot check out of the blue, that everybody gets spot checked at least once a week by me because I’d be out and about anyways, right? So, um, that’s just another little tip that, uh, you know, train them to do it right. And then just, um, I think it’s Peter Drucker that had, um, um, everything, um, measured improves, everything measured and reported improves exponentially. And you want to just report on them, stop in, take a look, you know, kind of have a little, you know, every restaurant that’s worth its weight has mystery shoppers.

John Clendenning [00:44:41]:

You know, every franchise has mystery shoppers. We don’t when we run independent businesses. We should, right? I even had some of our clients that knew me for years and years and years. I would just, I would call them up knowing there’d be a job coming up and I just, one of our newer technicians maybe had finally been out on the gone through a couple of months or two of training. He’s ready to be on the truck on his own, learned everything. And I would call up, you know, Allison or whatever and say, hey, I noticed you’re on the schedule for, you know, 2 weeks from now. You’ve used us for the last 15 years. Can I get you to do me a favor? Do a little bit of a mystery shop? I’m just watch for, you know, all this kind of stuff.

John Clendenning [00:45:18]:

It’s just new technician. We just want to make sure he’s doing all the things right. He’s not going to know who mystery shop. But as a thank you, I’ll give you a $50 gift certificate off your next cleaning or off this cleaning or whatever. And we just pick it like that. Just, just ways to have another set of eyes on it as well, right? Somebody you knew that would trust you more than, you know, trying to befriend the technician and stuff like that. So again, we got to run great businesses. And again, I would have learned that from a cassette or a podcast, not, not because I’m brilliant.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:45:44]:

I don’t have to be brilliant. I just have to absorb it and try it. So that’s it.

Nick [00:45:48]:

Yeah, just –  and yeah, like you said, just try it and see what works, see what doesn’t work, and then yeah, keep going.

John Clendenning [00:45:53]:

Yeah, cool. So if anybody wants to reach out to you, um, because obviously this goes out to the world of cleaners, but it also goes out to the world of consumers and, and all that kind of stuff, um, what’s the best way to reach out to you and, uh, and, and get on your radar?

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:46:05]:

I’d probably say, um, just go through our website, um, www.exceedcarpetcleaning.com.au. Um, you’ll find all our contact information and our, um, uh, what our previous work, work stories and things like that on there, a little bit about us, um, and what we do.

John Clendenning [00:46:24]:

Perfect. Yep, that’s the easiest way to go for sure. And yep, I really appreciate your time. Um, I think a lot of people are going to get a lot of value out of this because you’ve, you really thought your way through, um, this last 18 months. And these are the type of businesses that, regardless of what disruption’s happening around us, um, have the right mindset to dig in, work even harder, solve the problems, and not just rely on, you know, a Facebook ad or, you know, I need more leads kind of thing. No, build a real business and the real people will show up. So, so really appreciate your time. And, uh, yeah, thanks so much.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:46:56]:

And, and yeah, go crush them today, man.

Nicholas Martinuzzi [00:46:58]:

Thanks very much. I appreciate it.